Combines Anyone see the R65A R75A silver Massey rotor IJ

Why don't farmers complain (maybe they do - I stay out of coffee shops) about the pick-up truck market the way they do the machinery marketIJ Much more change takes place in the pick-up truck market and we still buy whatever they produce and if we don't like the most recent, we have the dealer go and find us a "last year's" model and drive it until the latest model_style_technology sinks in. Farm machinery is the same way.

Are you saying we should just give up on Gleaners because Agco has decided that the Massey rotor is the futureIJ

I didn't say that, per se. But, if AGCO decides to forgo the transverse Gleaner rotor for the Massey axial rotor that's AGCO's call and the consumer can only voice their opinion via their checkbook. Opinions via word of mouth don't carry much weight in these types of matters. Money is the only quantifier_qualifier here. I'm always finding out new things that just make me scratch my head and ask "why did they do that, when what they had before worked just fine." I guess they just wanted make it better. We can't discourage those who try to better themselves. I thought the 750 was great and anything better couldn't be possible until the 860, then I went with an 8820 and then the 9600 came out, then the 9610, then the 9750STS. Well, maybe not the STS. I went lexion after a short bout with STSitis.

Well I certainly have nothing against the Massey Rotor, having had one of the first 9700 Whites in 1979 and buying four more before they went bankrupt. I ran two of them until 1994 when I bought a Gleaner R72. Where I live we have no Massey dealers left that sell combines, carry parts and provide service and the few Gleaner dealers we have left would rather sell Gleaners. When I have asked my Caterpillar dealer to demo a challenger combine, he just says "buy a lexion". Perhaps I had more faith in Agco than they have in their customers. They lost several combine deals because of the year end certificate program and Kevin Bien their combine sales manager is aware of that, what he may not be aware of is how many tractor deals where also lost because of it. It seems to me Agco has not only written off the small to medium sized farmer, they have also written off Massey and Agco Allis dealers, hopeing to trust their future to the Cat-Challenger dealers, at least in North America

I am far from being in the "know" here but I think your stories are a little off. The "A" series Gleaners are being introduced to give a Gleaner dealer in the middle of nowhere the ability to sell an axial flow combine if the customer desires it instead of signing a Massey contract and everything that goes with it. I still don't see the R series Gleaner being discontinued any time in the near future. If they did, then one could conclude that corporate offices have their head in the sand pile. The "certificate" program you elude to was to clean out Cummins powered production at the end of the year and move us on to bigger and better things with the new (to us)engines. My .02 for what its worth.

If your version is right then tell me why I was told that since all the certificates had been given out I would have to pay $10,000 to another dealer to get a new Sisu powered Gleaner which I did not need delivery on till JulyIJ I know they lost at least 5 combine deals because of this and none of them were for Cummins powered units. I was assured by a company official that the situation would be corrected in January. However lost is lost.

The certificates were only good on existing inventory and expired on December 31, 2005. If they were not used they expired and were without value. I don't have nay ideas about your particular situation. Where are you fromIJ

RJT, I just read your post. You have a very interesting story to tell. I am wanting to talk to more former White 9700_9720 owners just like you, in order to find out about these huge combines and their performance. Yes, I agree with all you have said about the politics of AGCO so far. In fact, it's gotten so discouraging lately, that I'm getting to the point I no longer just jump right in and read this kind of stuff right away. Basically what land Surfer is saying, is "If it's not broke, don't fix it." I agree. The Gleaner as such is a great design and after a period of transition, has proven to be a tremendous success. The Masseys as we knew them, ended at Brantford in 1988. The White rotary [old Verity plant also in Brantford] stayed on after being purchased by AGCO. As far as I'm concerned even with a new name [8590 and 8570], those machines were still WHITE, not Massey. Their heritage was all White, period. My only contention was that AGCO dropped the big 8590 from the line and only produced the smaller 8570 for years. Now this new "Massey" is as much AGCO is it is White. I can't see a drop of Mssey blood here, either. Also from what I've been told, this new 9790 is still not even as big [maybe just rotor-wise] as the original 9700-8590. Some of my friends are going back and buying original White 9700's, 9720's and even 8590's for use on the harvest run as well as their farms. Personally, I'm thrilled to hear of this, as I believe in saving what few of these giants we have left.